Select UK's new FM frequency??

Discuss all things relating to the busy London Pirate Radio scene.
User avatar
Twista UK
no manz can test innit
no manz can test innit
Posts: 154
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2015 7:54 am

Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by Twista UK » Tue Jul 21, 2020 9:09 pm

Just found out Select UK are going legal soon and I wondering if anyone knows what frequency they will be getting or what possible frequencies they might be coming on?

famefm
proppa neck!
proppa neck!
Posts: 1983
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:34 pm

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by famefm » Fri Aug 14, 2020 9:41 am

From the recent form of pirates going legal recently I am sure it's going be another let down I don't think I even care what frequency other than I wonder what ofcom give

User avatar
g33ky
no manz can test innit
no manz can test innit
Posts: 232
Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2019 10:39 am
Location: Wirral

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by g33ky » Fri Aug 14, 2020 10:07 am

famefm wrote:
Fri Aug 14, 2020 9:41 am
From the recent form of pirates going legal recently I am sure it's going be another let down I don't think I even care what frequency other than I wonder what ofcom give
I don't know, Select has been acting better than 90% of community stations for years, they could probably change absolutely nothing about their presentation style once they go legal. Hope they keep the station like it is now, it's one of the finest stations (licenced or unlicensed) there is.
FM for lyfe!

famefm
proppa neck!
proppa neck!
Posts: 1983
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:34 pm

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by famefm » Sat Aug 15, 2020 12:54 am

Let's wait and see I know what you mean it is one of only a few stations who sound legal now but something always changes and never better after they get a licence

Nick_G
big in da game.. trust
big in da game.. trust
Posts: 59
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2014 10:00 am

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by Nick_G » Fri Aug 21, 2020 9:00 pm

99.2?

User avatar
mpx
no manz can test innit
no manz can test innit
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:49 am

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by mpx » Sat Aug 22, 2020 9:05 am

The allocation will depend whether Ofcom are still sticking to the ITU rules of not using frequencies that are an IF (intermediate frequency) image of a strong local station (+/-10.7MHz) or its 1st adjacent (+/-10.6 & 10.8) or the over-generous signal protection ratios previously in place.

If they are sticking to the IF image rule (that they deviated from once already in North Bristol), that rules out any frequencies (or adjacent ones) to the IF image of anything from Crystal Palace and Croydon masts, being 1km and 3km from Select's output site. BBC's Kenley repeater on 88.4, 90.6, 92.8 and 98.0 is also a stone's throw, and Caterham not much further on 89.7, 91.9, 94.1 and 99.3

Select has been on 99.3 for quite some time with it would seem very little issue to the Caterham repeater. One could surmise that a mast null was in that direction and therefore there was no interference. But I wouldn't imagine that Ofcom would allocate a frequency that is co-channel or adjacent to one already allocated within a short distance, being that they seem to be sticking with those ITU protection ratios.

But stranger things have happened!

Who knows, maybe we will see a relaxing of those 'rules' and some freeing up of more frequencies. After all, they've managed to find three for South London!

If I was a betting man, I would put a wager on 94.4 being one of the three.

famefm
proppa neck!
proppa neck!
Posts: 1983
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:34 pm

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by famefm » Sat Aug 22, 2020 10:40 am

I heard that 94.5 is a possibility that ofcom will give but possibly not for new stations to the south of London because R4 is in Brighton on 945 and when voice of Africa first came on they had 94
3 before ofcom gave them 94.0 for a very short while

User avatar
mpx
no manz can test innit
no manz can test innit
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:49 am

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by mpx » Sat Aug 22, 2020 11:07 am

94.3 might be a possibility, but it's 10.6MHz below Radio X on 104.9 - this wasn't an issue for Voice Of Africa in East London but could be an issue for Select as they're 1km away from the Crystal Palace tower.

Modern radios are more selective and have better filtering so, in reality, it shouldn't be much of an issue. Doesn't bother the French, they have stations 10.7MHz apart on the Eiffel Tower and planes haven't fallen..

Slightly off-topic, but I believe Voice of Africa asked to be moved due to pirate interference on 94.2 and 94.4 - oh the irony! :D

User avatar
g33ky
no manz can test innit
no manz can test innit
Posts: 232
Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2019 10:39 am
Location: Wirral

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by g33ky » Sat Aug 22, 2020 11:34 am

mpx wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 11:07 am
94.3 might be a possibility, but it's 10.6MHz below Radio X on 104.9 - this wasn't an issue for Voice Of Africa in East London but could be an issue for Select as they're 1km away from the Crystal Palace tower.

Modern radios are more selective and have better filtering so, in reality, it shouldn't be much of an issue. Doesn't bother the French, they have stations 10.7MHz apart on the Eiffel Tower and planes haven't fallen..

Slightly off-topic, but I believe Voice of Africa asked to be moved due to pirate interference on 94.2 and 94.4 - oh the irony! :D
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/ ... africa.pdf

"However, this was not backed up by the evidence from Ofcom’s spectrum monitoring report, confirmed at the hearing by the Ofcom Manager of Broadcast Radio who had carried out the monitoring and was in attendance to answer any questions on thetechnicalfindings. He explained that no interference was found during the period in question on the two channels immediately on either side of VoAR’s frequencyof 94.3MHz."

VOAR were such a bunch of goons, how they got a license in the first place baffles me.
FM for lyfe!

famefm
proppa neck!
proppa neck!
Posts: 1983
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:34 pm

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by famefm » Sun Aug 23, 2020 2:02 am

Voice of Africa did ask to be moved and don't forget in those days there were more pirates so 943 is a possibility and there still seems more interest when a new fm small scale station is about to come on fm than there is for a larger DAB licence for an ex pirate

User avatar
Undercover Neckz
tower block dreamin
tower block dreamin
Posts: 252
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2014 11:23 am
Location: Northolt

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by Undercover Neckz » Sun Aug 30, 2020 9:32 pm

I heard Select is gonna be going on 100.0 and Kiss FM is gonna have to find a new dial.

famefm
proppa neck!
proppa neck!
Posts: 1983
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:34 pm

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by famefm » Mon Aug 31, 2020 8:46 am

No you didn't stupid boy lol I really have my doubts about a legal select if it is better than the pirate version I will eat this phone I am using to send this

User avatar
Undercover Neckz
tower block dreamin
tower block dreamin
Posts: 252
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2014 11:23 am
Location: Northolt

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by Undercover Neckz » Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:10 pm

You dont know your talking about or what I heard or where I heard it from, you are no1 in radio and I am MASSIVE in the radio game. Trust.
Watch and you might learn something!!!

famefm
proppa neck!
proppa neck!
Posts: 1983
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:34 pm

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by famefm » Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:04 pm

Sorry I didn't mean I thought it was a joke? If true 100 would mean it would be able to get a long way out sorry mate if true that is a very good dial for a so called community staition so where would kiss go ?

famefm
proppa neck!
proppa neck!
Posts: 1983
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:34 pm

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by famefm » Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:08 pm

You are right no one now just a very long time ago in the 80s and the odd guest in the early 2000s you got to admit it not what you expect for the 30 years old kiss 100 to move surely we would not be lucky enough to see it off fm

bravedaveyboy
who u callin ne guy bruv
who u callin ne guy bruv
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2020 11:41 am

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by bravedaveyboy » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:16 pm

My guesses for these new South London frequencies would be three out of this list of four:

90.0 (between Radio 2 Caterham and Radio 3 Guildford);
92.2 (between NuSound and Radio 4 Guildford);
94.4 (between Radio 4 Caterham and BBC London);
99.5 (between Radio 1 Caterham and Kiss)

If I was a betting man I would put money on 94.4 being the most likely of these, perhaps for Croydon FM, then Select and Rainbow, each on one of the other three remaining choices.

After the new additions to the dial have been added, some stations will definitely have to shift frequencies if they are to remain on air. The best currently vacant frequency for the evicted stations to target would be 99.1, with 95.1, 97.5, and 100.4 as the other, not so good, options. These last three are all very close to main Crystal Palace/Croydon transmissions, but not impossible to imagine: Lightning (90.8), Supreme (99.8), Concious (102.0), and Playback (105.6) all do it, amongst others.

Thoughts anyone?

User avatar
mpx
no manz can test innit
no manz can test innit
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:49 am

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by mpx » Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:33 am

I think 92.2 is out because of Nomad in Hammersmith and Sheppey FM on the Isle Of Sheppey.

99.5 might warrant more power to get over the noise floor as Radio 1 from Wenvoe in Wales regularly pops up (250kW).

bravedaveyboy
who u callin ne guy bruv
who u callin ne guy bruv
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2020 11:41 am

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by bravedaveyboy » Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:11 pm

You're right, Nomad on 92.2! It's not on the Ofcom TxParams spreadsheet, so I missed it. Thank you!

So I will plump for 90.0, 94.4, and 99.5 for the three new frequencies. Spectrum planning anyone?

Venture comes through loud and clear on 99.5 on my Roberts portable in SE1.

I wonder when there'll be an announcement. Place your bets!
mpx wrote:
Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:33 am
I think 92.2 is out because of Nomad in Hammersmith and Sheppey FM on the Isle Of Sheppey.

99.5 might warrant more power to get over the noise floor as Radio 1 from Wenvoe in Wales regularly pops up (250kW).

User avatar
mpx
no manz can test innit
no manz can test innit
Posts: 147
Joined: Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:49 am

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by mpx » Tue Nov 17, 2020 2:18 pm

The coverage map for Nomad 92.2 is missing from Ofcom's site; however, it is available on another site. All evidence suggests they are still on the air, although I can't hear it so unable to confirm myself.

Other possible frequencies within the London/M25 area that could be used for Community Radio (that haven't been mentioned already):

88.2 (but possibly not in parts of SW London/Surrey)
89.4 subject to 10.6 IF allowance (100.0, Crystal Palace) and within BBC R2 CP 88.8 service area if subject to restrictions
89.8 subject to 10.8 IF allowance (100.6, Crystal Palace)
90.2 (except in some parts of SW London/Surrey)
90.6 (except in some parts of SW London/Surrey)
91.6 (except Hayes/Heathrow area to protect Hayes FM on 91.8)
92.4 (except some parts of W/SW London to protect Nomad FM 92.2)
92.8 (except in some parts of SW London/Surrey)
93.8 (except in East London, to protect Revive FM on 94.0)
94.2 (except in East London, to protect Revive FM on 94.0)
99.1 (within BBC R1 CP 98.5 service area if subject to restrictions)
99.3 (except in some parts of SW London/Surrey)
101.8 subject to 10.8 IF allowance (91.0, Crystal Palace)
102.8 (except in some parts of SW London/Surrey)
104.2 (except Central London to protect Resonance FM on 104.4)

So there are quite a few that could work, given enough power. And if a few BBC relays were moved or turned off, there would be more. It would be great to see more London pirates getting licensed and in turn clear up the mess on the dial! It's 2020, and you can still hear hums, sprogs and splatter, not to mention the awful sound quality of some!

It will be interesting to see where they all end up. It might give clues to future frequency availability for London FM licenses. Especially as Croydon FM have specified the Croydon mast as their output site, and Rainbow to co-site with Reprezent, this puts previously held conceptions about frequency spacing and Intermediate Frequency effects into question. Receivers are much more selective and less prone to reception issues than they were when the frequency planning 'rules' were created, so hopefully, we will see more stations coming on air. I can't see FM going away any time soon, although we might see some of the bigger broadcasters dropping some transmissions in favour of Digital or Online, which can't be a bad thing for some more diversity on the airwaves :whistle

bravedaveyboy
who u callin ne guy bruv
who u callin ne guy bruv
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Oct 31, 2020 11:41 am

Re: Select UK's new FM frequency??

Post by bravedaveyboy » Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:36 pm

Some further notes on these:

89.4 subject to 10.6 IF allowance (100.0, Crystal Palace) and within BBC R2 CP 88.8 service area if subject to restrictions
- plus Westside on 89.6 affecting use in West London.

89.8 subject to 10.8 IF allowance (100.6, Crystal Palace)
- plus Radio 2 Caterham on 89.7 affecting use in South London.

92.4 (except some parts of W/SW London to protect Nomad FM 92.2)
- plus Radio 4 Guildford on 92.5 also affecting use in South West London.

94.2 (except in East London, to protect Revive FM on 94.0)
- plus Radio 4 Caterham on 94.1 affecting use in South London.

99.1 (within BBC R1 CP 98.5 service area if subject to restrictions)
- plus Radio 1 Caterham on 99.3 affecting use in South London.

101.8 subject to 10.8 IF allowance (91.0, Crystal Palace)
- plus KMFM on 101.6 from Wrotham affecting use in South East London.

102.8 (except in some parts of SW London/Surrey)
- plus Heart Essex on 102.6 from Bakers Wood affecting use in North East London.

104.2 (except Central London to protect Resonance FM on 104.4)
- plus BBC Surrey on 104.0 from Reigate affecting use in South London.

I'm such a geek! :lol: :tup

Post Reply